To clarify – I didn’t criticise the book because Twenty is a blogger or because I wanted to get one up on anyone (don’t really see how that would work) or because I wanted to make a name for myself (better and more hideously embarrassing ways of doing that, were I so inclined).
I criticised it because I didn’t think it was good. I hoped it would be better. I’m all for bloggers getting book deals – it’s a fantastic way of widening out the field of books published here and elsewhere.
So if I thought the book was up to scratch or the best thing I’d read all year, I would have said so. But I didn’t. Sorry, but there you have it. I’ll wait for the books from Grandad and Fiona McPhillips and if I think they’re good, I’ll say it. I know I’ll love the Icecream Ireland book if it has half as much wit and panache as the blog concerned.
Of course most blogs are either personal or specialist, but I still don’t think we have that many really excellent examples of either. To quote Haydn, “I don’t read many Irish blogs because they are inward looking, technical or incestuous.” Maybe as Mark Waters said below there in a comment, that’s because the Irish blogosphere is reflective of Ireland.
Mind you, there’s me complaining about a lack of intellectual rigour and, what do you know, people start referencing Ionesco in blog posts.
Actually, Haydn also mentioned Sweary’s blog and I would have certainly given props to her were she still blogging all the time. Arse End of Ireland was crude at times, but it gave fantastic insight into a side of Irish society that many people pretend doesn’t exist. I voted for it as Best Blog last year and thought it should have been obligatory reading for anyone in a position to effect any change.
Also, want to clarify that I didn’t say Irish bloggers were philistines. I said we, meaning Irish people, are philistines when it comes to digital culture i.e. out there in the wider world, the majority of Irish people don’t get blogging or the point of blogging. That was one of the main points I was trying to communicate. It’s a fantastic medium, but it’s not anywhere near mature here yet.
One of the commenters on Twenty’s site said that the Sunday Times is an MI5 mouthpiece. That’s true, actually. Our pens shoot bullets and our Dictaphones are really state-of-the-art surveillance thingies.
Lastly, in case anyone thought I lacked the courage of my convictions, I wasn’t at the Blog Awards because I was otherwise engaged celebrating my brother’s 40th. Faaahmlee comes first.
17 Comments
March 3, 2008 at 8:59 pm
Judging by the tone of the part deux I thought at first you’d been chewed up somewhere so I took a look around at a few blogs and found nothing much. Did I miss something? I thought it was a good article. Criticism in Ireland is usually an us and them affair and everyone gets prickly when it’s a one-to-one, so hats off for stepping into that area. I find it a drag on Irish creativity that we’re not more critical, that there isn’t more of a “critic” (I don’t mean complaining) culture. To pick apart what we create is a natural part of the process – everyone who has written – music, articles, books, blogs – knows the moment of deconstruction is always close at hand.
March 3, 2008 at 9:05 pm
Nah didn’t really get especially chewed up, other than where you might expect. If the tone implied that, probably just cos I’m wrecked…been flat out.
Absolutely agree with you though…and I’ve been “deconstructed”, often unflatteringly, plenty of times. Criticism can be hard to take, but if it’s considered, well, then it’s both useful and necessary.
One of the reasons I wrote the blog piece in the first place was because I think there isn’t enough critical (again, not necessarily negative) analysis or debate around it…and there should be. Blogging will only get more important.
March 3, 2008 at 10:26 pm
I didn’t agree with a lot of what you said in your post and I haven’t read the book to pass judgement myself but I don’t see why your opinion should be looked upon any differently because you’re a blogger or because of the way you use your blog.
In terms of where we as Irish bloggers are, it’s impossible to say that such a broad group is at a specific stage of maturity but I got a definite vibe from this year’s IBAs that the community is at a tipping point. It didn’t feel quite as niche as it did last year and in general the audience seemed more sure of itself and each other… if you know what I mean.
Two years ago I wrote an article in The Irish Times about IrishElection.com and it was vital at the time to explain what a blog was; compare that to how big a role blogs played in the US elections in 2004 and you can see how late we were in blooming.
Considering this I think we’re doing well to catch up and I think the amount of good, consistent content has risen over the past year. The audience has risen too, which doesn’t necessarily say anything about quality but does indicate that Irish blogs are fast becoming more than early adopters slapping each other on the back.
March 3, 2008 at 10:55 pm
I agree – things are improving – and I did say that in the piece. Still worth teasing out why more people don’t blog here and why we don’t get certain types of blogs that you see elsewhere.
I’m not of the opinion that all Irish blogs are shite – I read and enjoy many of them – but we haven’t seen the emergence of any truly influential or markedly insightful bloggers here and the reasons for that are worth discussing. Perhaps it is indeed merely a factor of our late blooming.
Anyway I should really be writing. As per your FB status the other day, I can hear whooshing.
March 4, 2008 at 2:35 am
I appreciate that alright – although I don’t really agree with your reasons as to why we’re not there yet I can’t say for sure why I think it’s the case.
I do think it has a lot to do with our late start, though, as blogs really took off in the US in 2000-2001 or so. In that case we should be reaching a similar level of maturity in time for the local and European elections next year so hopefully we’ll be dominating the debate then!
From the point of view of my own interests I think we are lacking a heavy-weight political blogger, although we’re not without political blogs. I think Harry McGee came closest to being the first but sadly his new job seems to have him too busy to maintain this for now.
It’s chicken and egg in that situation, though. Do politicians trust bloggers and provide information to them, thus making them major players in the discussion or do bloggers become major players in the discussion and through this make contacts with politicians who provide information to them?
Anyway… the sound of wooshing has become a loud, engine-like drone around my way – hence being up at half 2 in the morning. Off to bed, and up early to carry on with the writing!
March 4, 2008 at 6:55 am
I loved the ST piece and thanks for posting it – since abandoning TV I seldom open the Culture section and would have missed it. Mea culpa, mea culpa.
You are perfectly right when you say the majority of Irish people don’t get blogging or the point of blogging. Irish people don’t get I.T. in general and are quite uneducated. Tell someone you are a web designer and they will ask you to have a look at their printer. No one asks a carpenter to wire a socket.
Ask any Irish blogger and they will tell you half, or more, of their readers are from outside the State.
The Irish mejia hate blogging and bloggers. Either they are seen as a threat or of such low quality as to be belittled.
It may be a catch 22, no, make that catch 44, situation, but once the Irish mejia come to view blogging as a compliment to journalism not a threat and the Irish public become sufficiently literate to appreciate the medium, then the milk of Irish blogging will be whipped into quality by wider public scrutiny and criticism and the cream will rise.
Well that’s enough of me pretending to be markedly insightful for this year – I’m going back to my own blog now to write just for the craic. That’s why I do it afterall – I don’t want to be influential – they’d make me wear a tie.
Happy birthday to the bro, by the way.
March 4, 2008 at 11:04 am
Thanks so much for the mention, Kathy, and I do hope you’ll like it… I saw the article and like you am waiting for the “break-out” blogs, especially in the political arena. What amazes me is that virtually the entire population is carrying recording devices (mobile phones with camera and video) and yet don’t seem to understand the power of that, especially when it comes to embarrassing politicians! In terms of quality, writing is writing and blogging is just another medium. I think we’ll get a wider range of people blogging over time (especially once they see bloggers are getting book deals!) once they get past their technological phobias…
March 4, 2008 at 12:00 pm
It’s easier to say than to do: but you shouldn’t be feeling uncomfortable about giving your point of view, as you did in the Sunday article. I know unquestioning acceptance of whatever is handed down to you is time-honoured here (though our customers are learning to speak up on the super-subjective topic of wine) , but owning opinions that may differ from others’ is not a stumbling step, in my humble. And by the by, speaking your own mind needn’t preclude tact, or humility, or political considerations. Blogs are a perfect way for folks to articulate their views, once they’ve overcome the techno-fear (I share Kieran’s amazement that all the gadgeteers aren’t more concerned to shape the republic from their keypads), and once they’ve made the time. I’m a fairly lazy person with a manageable routine, but it’s a struggle to write an intelligent post because there is never a minute to spare. Now if I were a politician, I can’t see where the blog time would come from – especially given the microscopic sub-editing needed in that realm, and the increasing amount of intellectual rigour about.
March 4, 2008 at 12:58 pm
There are all sorts of blogs and reasons why people write blogs. This is as true of Ireland as elsewhere. How many completely inconsequential blogs are written in America? Tens of thousands?
Some blogs are intentionally close to journalism – forms of op/ed writing, for instance – and are commercial insofar as the writing is paid for and therefore the writer’s time is paid for. They’re a minority.
I liken blogging to the pseudonymous pamphleteering and satirical writing found in Britain and Ireland in Swift’s time. Who knows what it may evolve into. I’m happy for it to be a free for all which, crucially, is not mediated or commodified by some established editorial business model.
The quality of hard copy publication and TV broadcasting has diminished greatly in recent times, mostly because of commercial pressures.
The same voices are everywhere and the combination of lifestyle fillers and long-in-the-tooth opinion writing is boring, tired and predictable. .
It may sell things, including a comforting image of ourselves, but it challenges none of our preconceptions. Real news and meaningful reportage is hard come by these days.
Put simply, the established media are not telling us challenging stories. I wouldn’t claim that blogs necessarily tell us these stories, but some do. And they do it for free.
I don’t believe Irish blogs are obliged to ‘do’ or to ‘be’ anything in particular. Nor do they have some sort of responsibility in the social context.
Being disappointed with them or giving out about them seems futile, like they owe us something. They don’t. It’s not like we’re paying them to do it.
March 4, 2008 at 5:53 pm
I dunno if I dare write one now…
*goes away and takes a Prozac*
March 4, 2008 at 7:44 pm
Good man Grandad!
Kathy,
I agree with much of what you say. The Irish Blogosphere is still relatively young in terms of its development.
That doesn’t mean, as I think some people seem to think it does, that there are not quality blogs and excellent writers blogging just that the depth and breadth of that talent is not as obvious as it is in the US where blogging is much more developed.
Good original column and follows too!
Eoin
March 4, 2008 at 8:16 pm
Why should blogging be influential? The major journalists like Charlie Bird and Olivia O’Leary are well paid to report, and we the public are influenced by that calibre of journalism. I skimmed through your article in the ST on blogging, and I think you take yourself too seriously. Blogging as a medium does not purport to be a serious form of journalism. To most bloggers it is fun. They like to write about the relative merits of toilet paper, and the like.
Lighten up, Kathy…
March 4, 2008 at 10:23 pm
Said most of what I wanted to over on the other thread, but just a few quick points.
Adam: I think bloggers will have to prove themselves to politicians and other sources if they want to be trusted with info, the same way a working journalist or even anyone else they have to deal with (trade union leaders, business groups) would have to prove themselves.
Primal: Shame on you for not reading Culture. It’s full of cultural stuff, how can you resist it? And other than that, I think you were very insightful there…will pass on your regards to the brother
Julian: Agreed. As I said in the original piece, blogging well takes time. That’s often what’s stopped me – no time and the nagging suspicion that if I could blog about it, maybe I could write a piece about it. And, no, I’m not uncomfortable about giving my opinion, but like anyone, I get frustrated when points are misunderstood or taken out of context.
Conan: Love the comparison with pamphleteering. Great analogy. As for being disappointed, again, it’s not so much that I’m disappointed with the blogs out there, I’m disappointed at the lack of what Kieran described as “break-out blogs”.
Grandad: Be brave! Sure, you’ve seen the worse that can happen
Granny: I’m nearly chuffed at someone saying I take myself too seriously. I’m usually accused of being too flippant. At the risk of once again seeming to take myself too seriously, I should point out that the brief was to attempt some serious analysis of blogging in Ireland!
March 4, 2008 at 11:20 pm
I must say my response would be very similar to, if not identical to Primal’s.
You imply to Julian that “a blogger must write well”. Why? If someone is writing for their own pleasure, then surely they should write as they feel fit? If I were to dabble in painting and produce daubs, then should I be prevented from hanging them on my front wall for people to see? Must I be a Picasso? After all, my offerings are free to read or reject at the public’s whim. That is the essential difference between blogging and journalism.
If I buy a paper, I expect informed opinion, well presented, because I have paid for it. However, blogging is a free medium. Speaking personally, I write for the fun of it, for my own pleasure. If people don’t like it, they can go to the other millions of blogs. They have lost nothing and nor have I.
I appreciate that there are bloggers who write from an informed base, such as the technical bloggers, who must pay more attention to their facts. However, I don’t think there are many who would see themselves as informed news sources or shapers of public opinion.
I have to agree with Granny too [well - I have to, don't I?] about serious analysis of blogging. Because it is completely unregulated and free, you will have everything out there from the sublime to the ridiculous. Where do you start? What are your parameters? It is like trying to psychoanalyse a lake-full of assorted fish. And how do you decide whether it is mature or not? What is maturity in blogging? When the minnows are weeded out from the salmon?
Maybe the answer should be that all bloggers are paid according to talent? Now that would start the fun!
Damnit!! There goes my idea for tomorrows scribble…………
March 4, 2008 at 11:52 pm
Hi Kathy,
I am a Yank who blogs and I really enjoy a bunch of Irish blogs. Come to think of it, the first three I read every morning are Irish blogs.
I don’t tell people around here that I blog because I’ll just get the old rolled eyes and knowing side glances. Everybody and their brothers have blogs or have had blogs. I’m looked at as being a geek and nerd because of it, so I don’t bother telling anyone about it. Here in the States blogging is old news.
The Irish blogs I read are fresh and come from a passion and a heartfelt desire to put their words on their pages for themselves and that is a good thing in my opinion.
I may not comment much on many blogs but Head Rambles, Grannymar and Bock the Robber are the first three blogs I read every morning.
I like the Irish bloggers attitude because it doesn’t have the grandiose expectation that is found on many of the large US based blogs. The sites are not ‘monetized’ as so many here are. If I want Irish political commentary I know where to find it. It’s out there. In more than one place. I couldn’t care less about Arsenal but I know where to find commentary about the IRFU when I want it.
Don’t be so down on the Irish blogging scene. It is vibrant, well done and maybe more alive than you think.
BTW, I’ve just added you to my blog roll.
March 5, 2008 at 3:20 pm
[...] to shoot herself in the foot by switching from the established media to blogging and writing a couple of articles on her blog, clarifying what she actually meant. The problem here, of course, is [...]
March 5, 2008 at 5:59 pm
Hmm. If Haydn doesn’t read many Irish blogs, how does he know they’re inward-looking, technical or incestuous?